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Author Topic: Better Advantage in Socializing  (Read 167 times)

Omidawn

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Better Advantage in Socializing
« on: December 15, 2017, 06:48:53 AM »

Socializing was difficult in the Demo, but it is really really difficult to get those first 2 hearts in the Alpha.

It takes twice as much to fill a heart, and there is some random disadvantage that periodically zaps 20-30 points off of people you are trying to work up.  I'm talking about people you are actively trying to get points with every day, suddenly lose half (or all) of their points for no reason.

I have two suggestions: 

First, if you manage to get someone to associate or higher, they are immune to this effect (whatever is causing it).

Second, anyone that you have talked to at least once during the week is immune to the effect (whatever is causing it).

It is just brutal to be undone this way, with no explanation or recourse.  Unless there is something or someone behind the scenes that is actively working against you, it makes no sense.  Even Higgins shouldn't be able to turn the whole town against you.  It is also really close to being a game breaker if you are interested in courting Ginger.  If you can't work her up faster than she gets knocked down, she will be your nemesis by the end of the first year.  It would be better to not meet her at all -- people you have not met do not change their disposition.

So, if staying in contact reasonably <once per week> eliminates the negative, then for those who are only 1-2 point gain per day (like Ginger), you can still eventually befriend them.  Like I said, knocking them constantly back to zero (or negative adversary) no matter how hard you try is just brutal, and not really very fun.

Also, if anyone knows the reason (or reasoning) behind the disadvantage, I'd really like to understand how it is justified.  Is it a bug or intentional?
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Omidawn

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Re: Better Advantage in Socializing
« Reply #1 on: December 16, 2017, 07:08:24 PM »

I just had another thought, and this might be better.

I would suggest (recommend) that once you reach a certain level, the person can't be debuffed back below that level.  Then, you can focus on getting a few people leveled up at a time, but the rest will simply go back to the start for the level they are on, if you don't actively work on them.

Strangers can still go negative, but Associate and above should never go back below the level that you have achieved with them.  I don't think I have seen anyone who was a buddy go back to being an associate, but I think that I have had associates go back to being strangers.  That shouldn't happen... it makes socializing too difficult.

EDIT: Upon reflection, I think I can understand why you want to have a regular attrition... it does make socializing more of a challenge, but you should never lose something that has been gained.  So, I stick by the recommendation: once you gain a heart, you shouldn't be able lose it.

Think of it this way:  It would be like saying, "well, you haven't been fighting for a while, so we're going to make you go back to using a bronze sword," or "well, you haven't been doing commissions for a while, so you're back to level C."  The point is, your social status with one of the townspeople is as much an "item" that has been earned as anything else in the game.  If you allow it to be so easily and arbitrarily taken away, then it is essentially a game breaker.  You are basically turning all of the townspeople into needy, greedy, self-centered people who are saying "pay attention to me, give me stuff, or I will turn against you."  Is that really the kind of town that you want to present?  Like I said, it is okay to attrition back to the beginning of that level, but NEVER take away a heart or star that has been completed.

Even if you keep attrition limited to the current heart or star, I would still cut attrition by at least half of what it now is.

I am at the point now of restarting, and not talking to anyone on the next play-through.  I would literally rather be real strangers with everyone than to be their enemy just because I'm busy working on commissions, or mining, or something else that takes me away from spending all day every day socializing.  If it were possible, I would not meet anyone except Presley, the Mayor, Petra, and whomever I picked to be my wife.  The "Meet and Greet" quest is social suicide.  Unfortunately, there are several others that you have to meet for personal quests, but I would not actually do those quests until I had leveled everyone else up to "buddy."  Even then, I would try to limit my "friends" to 7, so that I could play date with each one weekly to maintain their level.  In my opinion, that makes socializing too anti-social.  Attrition is not intuitive.  People don't and shouldn't act like that.  The only way you should ever lose points with socializing is if you haven't talked to someone for a month or more... that would be more realistic.  People are a lot more forgiving than you are giving them credit for... because everyone knows that they get just as busy themselves.  Forgive and be forgiven.  That is practically the definition of humanity.  The current level of attrition equals frustration, not challenge, because making a place for yourself in the community is an essential part of the game.  In order to actually do well, you have to be an isolationist and shun almost everyone in town (until you level up the first batch).  It is just not intuitive from a human perspective, and by the time you figure out what is happening, it is too late to do it differently.  You absolutely DO NOT want to talk to everyone to see what they have to say.

« Last Edit: December 17, 2017, 03:25:08 PM by Omidawn »
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BruceShi1994

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Re: Better Advantage in Socializing
« Reply #2 on: December 19, 2017, 05:57:03 AM »

Indeed, I think they really should look into this, it just makes me feel so bad...it also makes sence in real life. Sometime people want to leave themselves get alone, no intention to ignore their friends...
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